No Smoking In The UK..... !!!

[spike]

I know all the do's and don't about smoking, and that it's not good for your health etc etc so no preaching.

The UK government have voted to place a total ban on smoking in pubs and clubs, with no exception!! (Ireland and Scotland already have this law)

I just wondered what the outcome will be...... To the best of my knowledge, the biggest revenue of tax for the UK government is - Alcohol - Tobacco - Fuel. So if a total ban on smoking (comes into force March 2007) is in effect. Where will the government gain it's most lucrative taxes from.

I can see people either not going out (can't smoke) or people giving up (good thing for health), but one way or another, one will cease...... Therefor a drop in taxes. Where will the government Levi the taxes to fulfill this deforcite...... This I can see as being the biggest problem.

All my life I have been in pubs, clubs, bars etc... With lots of smoke, it not only adds to the atmosphere, it is also a British tradition.

Last Saturday, I went for a stroll around a small town near where I live and went into about 4 public houses. Two of these public houses already have a room cordoned off for None Smokers (this would be a better idea), the bar itself was crowded, 3 - 4 deep at the bar (quite busy pubs), but there was NO-ONE in the none smoking area...... !!!!

So to my point, as far as I know, all this none smoking in public bars etc, came from just one woman - griping on about passive smoking.

Can I just point out that I to am a None Smoker.... But I for one do not agree with the UK government THIS TIME..... Tony (Bad Boy) Blair has lost my vote....!!!

[jimthejanny]

totally agree spike i think this ban is going to have an effect on musicians because i think people will stop going out and the pubs and clubs will be empty apart from non smokers.they should have comprimised somehow with pubs and clubs having a smoking room with an exstractor fan in it.

[Emerald Midi]

I gotta say guys, as a non-smoker, I am fully behind this initiative by the British government. It is working wonderfully back here in Ireland (Republic) and I can't see it ever going back to the old days.

Sure, I have a certain sympathy for those addicted to cigarettes but hopefully this soon to be introduced ban will encourage many to quit, as has been happening back here. My own brother, a 40 cigarette a day man, gave up when the ban came in and feels on top of the world.

[spike]

I totally agree with you Emerald, but the concern I have is ----

Has there been any downward shift in Ireland, to the lack of venues for live artiste's and my second concern is have they bumped up any taxes to compensate the loss of revenue from tobacco or booze???

They must be losing £millions in lost taxes, and surely this has to come from elsewhere...... ?

Many may have packed up smoking or just don't bother going out so much.

Any info on this would be great......!!!

[geraint]

All I would like to say is where is the freedom of choice. If some pubs and bars were non smoking then thats where the non smokers would go.
Smoking pubs would attract the smokers, give them a choice PLEASE.
This Nanny state is going beyond.
We now have a National No Smoking Day, well to balance out the argument, and to comply with the equalities laws, surely we should have a National Smoking Day where the Non Smokers Must smoke.
Lets get real

Geraint

[Emerald Midi]

spike said:

I totally agree with you Emerald, but the concern I have is ----

Has there been any downward shift in Ireland, to the lack of venues for live artiste's and my second concern is have they bumped up any taxes to compensate the loss of revenue from tobacco or booze???

They must be losing £millions in lost taxes, and surely this has to come from elsewhere...... ?

Many may have packed up smoking or just don't bother going out so much.

Any info on this would be great......!!!

Spike I appreciate your points also. Here's a link that deals with the early days of the ban here in the south of Ireland:

www.vhi.ie/news/n030604a.jsp

Here's more current data:

www.ash.org.uk/html/publicplaces/html/irelandimpact.html

My own experience is that the venues I play are doing just fine. Initaly some felt the pinch but that only lasted until people got use to the idea.

[beccap]

I am a non smoker, and am really pleased for once with a government bill. I am sick of waking up the next day after a night out with the smell of smoke in my hair, on my best clothes, and on the bed. My fiance and I went out to our favourite restaurant last week which had introduced no smoking, and it was brilliant (and still as full as ever!). I think, like everything, there will be a period of adjustment, but it will be better for all in the long run.

[Emerald Midi]

Yep, agree entirely. Here in Ireland it is now simply a part of life and people, both smokers and nonsmokers, have benefited enormously as a result.

[picker50]

In cape Breton Canada there has been no smoking in bars and restraints for almost 2 yrs has relay
cut down on the number of patrons that come to the bar to listen to live music

[beccap]

So were people really there for the music in the first place? If they were, surely not being able to smoke indoors wouldn't have stopped them.

[Emerald Midi]

Good point but I guess some people just enjoy a cigarette while listening to music.

[keeeko]

I am in Australia and they are trying to bring out the non-smoking in pubs and clubs here. What most clubs have done is make the pokie section smoking, seems to be working. I don't know how the revenue from the pokies is used in the UK but here most of it is used to help the underprivalaged. When they cut out the smoking in clubs what happens to those people, will the Govt. give them more help, I don't think so! As far as I can see there are pros and cons for the non-smoking law. I wonder which one outweighs the other. I heard that the Aust Govt was going to ban people smoking in their own cars. I am a smoker and I don't mind not smoking on the train for a couple of hours, or in a resturant, or even in a shopping centre, but hey, we pay out taxes too, surely we have some rights.
Keeeko

[ccladdaghh]

Hi, I'm from Ottawa Canada.

There has been a non-smoking ban in all work & public places August 1, 2001 (enforcement began in September.) The following article can be read on this subject, called "Smoking Ban has no impact on food, drink sales: U of T research" (U of T = University of Toronto). A ban has also been started in Quebec as of May 31, 2006.

My brother-in-law has been playing in bands for many years. He is very pleased with the ban in the bars as he is a non-smoker and never liked the smell of his clothes/hair etc when he finished his gigs.

As for myself, I am an asthmatic. It would never stop me from going to see my brother-in-law play... or any band for that matter, but I can tell you that it affected my breathing on many occasions. I, too, love music and am so much happier going into a bar/pub etc to hear a band play where there is no longer any smoking. It's just so much easier on my health. I hope you can understand :-)

I listened to all the concerns when the ban was started in Ottawa. But I've been to see many bands play and the places are packed. I agree with what has been previously said, that there is an adjustment period. But all in all, with the fact that it is law and everything, people have conformed and are smoking outside. From this asthmatic, I am a happier pub crawler!!

As for taxes, I agree with you. I'm sure the Canadian/Ontario & Quebec governments definitely have an idea of how to kick it to the Canadian people to pick up more taxes elsewhere, now that they aren't making a killing (sorry for the pun) on cigarettes. I wonder if they've decided to do that via fuel taxes, since our gasoline now costs a small fortune!! So perhaps you are right from that standpoint. <groan>

Take care and all the best as the adjustment period kicks into your town,
Rose (Ottawa, Ontario)

[Emerald Midi]

Thanks for that Rose.

Here in Ireland the ban on smoking is going great, people, smokers and non-smokers, are now so used to the idea of the new laws they would be shocked to see anyone light up.

One year and four months ago these same people were in a terrible state, many convinced they could never accept the new law, but they are now expressing delight that they can actually breath fresh air in those once smoked filled places.

I'm a non smoker and the difference for me is too wonderful to explain but I will say this my wife loves the idea that when I come home my cloths are not reeking of dreaded tobacco smells

[geraint]

I appreciate what has been said, and I am a smoker, but the other night I payed in a non smoking venue, and it didn't bother me a bit ( PROBABLY A GOOD TIME TO GIVE UP), but when I got home, my wife was suspicious because after so many yars of gigging, I came home and didn't smell of stale tobacco.
You can't win can you.
Geraint

[Emerald Midi]

Wonderful story geraint. Just told it to the missus and she loved it too. Great stuff.

[a.j.]

We have had 'no smoking' legislation in South Africa for several years now, and people moaned initially, but life goes on. Since then, we have visited the UK several times, and I remember what it was like being a non-smoker in the pubs there, more so because there is no airconditioning filtering the air.

Being a non-smoker, I'm all for it, it's great for eatingout and gigging. All of the restaurants and bars offer smoking and non smoking sections.

In bars, the sections are not always divided by a physical barrier, but often in terms of how the smoke is removed from the air (if you know what I mean). We are fortunate in that we have the kind of weather where the smoking section can be outside on a terrace (although they do suffer a bit in winter!)

I know that tax revenue is raised as an issue, but what is the cost of smoking to the taxpayer in terms of medical costs, absenteeism and loss of productivity?

[ccladdaghh]

Hi A.J.,

Thanks for your addition to this topic. I did mention that the government would probably hit us (here in Ontario or Quebec, Canada) with more taxes on our gasoline ... and if they didn't hit us there... they would hit us elsewhere (I'm sure of that!)

But your points of the cost to taxpayers for medicals costs, absenteeism & loss of productivity (& loss of life as well??) is a much more important issue. I lost my mom to another disease but I do believe that she just couldn't keep her strength to fight because smoking had such a detrimental affect on her health, even before the breast cancer hit even hit her. And, you won't believe this, the doctor told her she could keep on smoking (even though she had to go thru chemo & radiation for her cancer) because the smoking didn't cause her breast cancer (yes, I know, I can hear the question being asked right now ... how stupid can he have been to say something that dumb.)

Anyway, that is just but one story about the effects of smoking on people's health (and what about the wee ones' lives who are near the smokers).

I, for one (as a non-smoker), applaud the counties, cities, countries around the world who are implementing this new law. For me, my son, my family and my friends. And, for you and yours as well.

I am not a smoker. But I understand the addiction for those who have started (especially long term smokers.) I know it's difficult to quit. I remember my Mom telling me all about it. I just wish she had quit. Perhaps she would have had the strength to make it thru her medical condition ... and be sitting here right beside me getting to know all of you.

Take care
Rose

[midimart]

Hi Rose.

That is a sad sad story..... One to take on board by everyone.

My mom is on oxygen (full time) right now, and housebound. It's her (and my fathers) diamond anniversary tomorrow.

We all believe all she is hanging on for is this special event. Yes it is all due to smoking, but in the day's of when my mom was a teenager it was the "In Thing".

It is very sad to lose a loved one this way, as god never intended anyone to go like this..... Can we blame sir Walter Raleigh for this???

Maybe Rose, that the doctors found they could do nothing for your mom, and told her she could continue smoking - So she could go out happy doing the thing she loved..... Please don't misunderstand me, but why be miserable to the last when one can be relatively happy....

My condolences on your sad loss....

[themd21]

The sad thing is that some folk still don't believe that smoking affects your health and those around you or they simply just don't care.
I'm off the smokes over 20 years and can honestly say I don't miss them at all. Over the years playing in smoked filled halls never bothered me much but lately I'm getting a bit p***ed off struggling for breath,waking up coughing,smelly clothes and my car stinks with tobacco from carrying my gear.
No I'll be quite happy when the smoking ban is enforced next April.

Cheers Jimmy G