Saving volume/instrument midi changes

[rosetchfie]

Although I have been editing midi files for several years ( mainly via Voyetra Record Producer) I have aways had difficulty saving volume and instrument changes on most files. The instrument changes seem to work on some files (esp where the midi instrument number shows up in the box when you originally open the file) - however many don't show this and they seem to be the hardest ones to change.
Similarly I often want to reduce the volume on the lead channel ( e.g. Ch 4) to still be there but just in the background and while I can I can do that on playback it never seems to save like that and I end up having to either live with it or mute the channel. Would appreciate someone throwing some light on why this might be for these 2 things
regards
Roy Setchfield
Waiuku, New Zealand

[midimart]

Hi Roy.

I agree this can be a pain.... I'm not familiar with Voyetra Record Producer and don't know if it has facilities to edit embedded data.

All you are doing is changing the volumes of playback and not altering the embedded changes. (Control Changes) or sometimes SySex. If a track has SySex to control changes, leave well alone.

If you download Jazzware Midi Sequencer and install it, I can talk you through it.

Firstly load in your midi file - then highlight the track you want to edit by clicking the far left box, next to the track. The track should now be highlighted.

Click on "Misc" at the op and scroll down to "Event List". This will open up another panel. You will now see the track contents. Notes, length, velocity, expression etc etc..... You will be looking for ctl 7, this is the volume of that particular instrument. Give this a lower value. The other one you can try is ctl 11, this is velocity, decrease this too.

Do the same for each instrument then save. You should now have the volume at the level you want it.

It is the same for instrument changes, the controller for these is prg. The only thing with sequencers is that you must decrease the prg by one. like if you want strings (49) you should put prg 48 or if you want brass (62) you should put prg 61 etc.

Some midi files have all the controls on one line. These can be changed in the same way.

Best of luck......

[steveb]

Hi Roy,

I have had had the exact same problem...Unable to change instruments or their volume in some Midi Files.

I then went into another program and changed them but when I play them again in Virtual Sound Canvas or Cakewalk all the instruments are changed to PIANO, It beats me

Anybody else got any clues??

Steve

[midimart]

This is usually due to a SySex message somewhere embedded again. It is telling the midi file to set all channels to zero - A Sysex Re-set.

If you can find the SySex then delete it and all should be ok. Unless it is what I call a 120 file (re-sets the tempo too), which is a very bad programmed file and there is virtually nothing you can do, unless you have Cubase or Sonar or one of the commercial sequencers.

By the way SySex stands for System Exclusive. If you are unsure what you are doing with SySex, leave well alone....... Get someone to alter it who knows about SySex. Try or

[rosetchfie]

Hi Midimart
Thanks - That makes sense to me - I have downloaded Jazz several times but can't get it to run on my PC despite trying all the compatability settings for 95,98 etc. Anyway I will keep persevering but sounds like reading the Voyetra manual might be a good idea for me to see if Record Producer can alter the embedded settings in a similar way.
regards
Roy Setchfield
Waiuku, New Zealand

[themd21]

Any copy of Cakewalk,even the free ones such as Cakewalk express can show up and remove all sysex events without any problems.
Sysex is meant to be specific to a module or keyboard, probably the machine or software the midi was created on or meant to be reproduced on.
For example XG in the Yamaha or GS in Roland, using the best sounds available.They effect the overall sound and set up of a midifile in different ways but thats a basic concept.

The basic controllers are
07............Volume
10............Pan
11............Expression
91............Reverb
93............Chorus
94............Delay
The 120 resets All notes
and 121 All Controllers.

I've never used Voyetra but I would imagine that all software sequencers would use the same basic set up and that an event list can in some way be used to alter the midi data.

Clear as mud but I hope it can be of some use.

[JazzCat]

Roy, could you send me some of the files you are having problems with and explain the problem for each file and exactly what you want to change. My expertise is with Voyetra Digital Orchestrator Pro, Record Producer MIDI and Record Producer Deluxe. If I can't figure out why you can't seem to save the changes within the Voyetra programs, no one can! LOL I already have an idea of why but I need to look at the files to know for sure.
I have a midimart addy.
Cat >^..^<

[smurfy]

I had the very same problem. The process I used to eliminate volume, chorus and reverb settings in tracks (in calkwalk and other midi editors) was:

1. open the midi file
2. view in the EVENTS (not sysex; this is information which is exclusive to a particular brand or type of instrument- non-standard midi) window - this will list the file as a series of midi events such as note, expression, pitch bend etc etc.
3. hide all note events with the button in the event window
4. delete all instances of Patch settings (instrumnent), Main Volume, chorus and Reverb.

repeat steps 3 and 4 for all tracks.

this usually works for most midi files and allows you to create your own mix and effects with your own patches.

there are some caveats though:

sometimes you may want to change the Initial Volume of each track from the Track View window.

if there are any Patch changes within one track (bad practice!) then copy and paste each patch section into a diffeent track; that way you will have more control.

It sounds complicated but it soon becomes an easy yet pain in the butt thing to do.

[ironbaden]

I use cakewalk 9 and removing the sysex is a click of a button.... so is adding controller changes...just let me know if u ever need help with CW9

[Steptoe]

smurfy said:

I had the very same problem. The process I used to eliminate volume, chorus and reverb settings in tracks (in calkwalk and other midi editors) was:


3. hide all note events with the button in the event window

How do you hide the note events? I have cakewalk Pro Audio 7

[midimart]

You can hide any or all of the events using the 'Filter Events'....

[Steptoe]

Apparently you can't in cakewalk 7! I've just installed cakewalk 9 and it is possible in that version.......

[midimart]

OOOOoooops.....

Just checked and my version is Cakewalk 9......... Sorry......

The Jazz Midi Sequencer has this facility and it is free to download from the main site......

[Steptoe]

I must be honest Glenn, I downloaded Jazz Midi Sequencer and didn't really like it. Each to his own I suppose..