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Post by shyamwestwind on May 5, 2008 5:23:08 GMT
Hi Everyone
I was at a gig last afternoon and later that evening they were going to have a Karaoke night with "live" backing tracks. complete with backing voices etc . It was real fun and exciting to hear professional backing tracks for so many popular tracks, and though it can never be as much fun as actually playing along , with or without midi files, it was quite an exhilarating experience to sing with this virtual "orchestra" with all the live band orchestration and voice backing.
It would be nice to do a few selected songs with these backing tracks, at gigs and I wonder if there are any sites where we could get these.
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Post by weegeo on May 5, 2008 7:35:15 GMT
Morning `Saint Shyam `lol you could try karaoke version this site gives you a choice of backing tracks with or without backing vocals and it`s quite inexpensive the onlt problem i have noticed is the tracks seem very `toppy`[to much treble] but you can tweak this out.Personally i don`t use tracks with b.vocals i think it makes it all quite impersonal but this is my own view hope this helps you a little
weegeo
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Post by ovation99 on May 5, 2008 7:39:05 GMT
Hi, there are hundreds of companies that provide full backing tracks on CD or DVD, such as Chartbuster Karaoke.com, CAVS etc.
A couple of things to remember though, unless you have a dedicated karaoke player, you will not be able to change the key and deviated too far from the original can make the resulting backing sound awful. Hence the beauty of midifiles.
Also, they are not cheap or as freely available as midifiles.
Having said all that, I agree that having the FULL backing does seem to boost your own performance.
I have a few thousand karaoke files which can be converted to mp3 with the appropriate software, so if you are after something in particular, drop me an e-mail and I'll see what I can do.
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Post by shyamwestwind on May 5, 2008 8:44:06 GMT
Frankly I think I just over reacted to the thought of singing with these "complete" backing tracks, but as weegeo said, it is impersonal and unlike the Midi files. I find that backing vocals are usually very accented and the levels are usually pretty high and will drown our vocals.
Guess I was a bit carried away, but I'm back to my normal self now. Actually, I guess it's everone's dream to sing with a full fledged orchestra complete with a Brass Section, Strings, Drums and Percussion and some throaty girl singers. Dreams, dreams dreams !
Thank you Ovation for your offer - I might need to ask you for help, but for the present I'm going to feel happy with my Midi Files from MidiMart, which lets me play around with them, as I please.
Sorry if I bugged you with my whims and fancies ............ dont get mad, please!
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Post by JohnG on May 5, 2008 12:51:28 GMT
Hi Shyam,
Backing tracks are what I produce for my partner to sing to on occasions when she can't sing with live musicians. I make up a MIDI file then create a few variants of it at different tempos, slight transpositions up or down, with some rubato here and there and with the fermata at different lengths, play around with crescendo and diminuendo, ritardando and accelerando until it suits her and sounds as natural as possible with her voice. Then we tend to stick with just a few versions. It works pretty well with the hardware I'm using now but I hope will be even better when I change over to VSTi later in the year when I've finished building my new DAW.
The key thing is that MIDI gives you the flexibility to create a file that is near enough perfect for you. However as a rock band, one of the key attractions, at least for me, is that each performance is slightly different with a feel to it that is difficult to match when it's all pre-recorded.
Just my 2d worth,
JohnG.
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Post by ovation99 on May 5, 2008 21:04:44 GMT
Got to agree with you JohnG.
Although as I said, I have loads of Karaoke backing tracks, but only use half a dozen of them on gigs against about 300 midifiles to choose from.
I probably tend to go for midifiles as that's what I've been used to over the last 10-15 years.
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Post by Emerald Midi on May 6, 2008 15:10:03 GMT
I use both, "live," and midi. All live when doing the Elvis thing, coz of backing vocals. When doing the regular show I mix it up  |
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Post by shanless on May 10, 2008 9:25:01 GMT
I was in our local hotel last night and one of the forum members was 'playing'.....he was using ALL karaoke backings..(some that faded out )... and had his guitar leaning against a chair all night.....to me I see this as a ripoff.....we who use midis spend hours getting them right whereas 'karaoke singers' just download, change the key and thats it......I have been doing karaoke for the last 18years and have thousands of tracks....but I wouldnt use them when gigging........to me it's just KARAOKE WITHOUT THE TV........its just my opinion
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Post by weegeo on May 10, 2008 12:59:17 GMT
I would agree i`m afraid we`re in the last days of our trade technology has brought this about.If i can explain it this way when i was in full time employment i worked as a telecomunications eng:[not telephones lol] i moved on to installing satellite systems both commercial and domestic that was my trade and then the big bang satellite tv took off in a big way and the employers needed the men to fill the contracts and all of a sudden binmen,taxi drivers,streetcleaners [nothing wrong with these skills] all became satellite engineers and i`m sure lots of good folk on this forum have a nightmare to tell about a sat:install. Well back to the point sorry now we have Tom,thingy and harry buying midi players and going out to `perform`without any experience at all....all this is doing is keeping good working musicians out of a job ask these guys that just stand and sing if they can back anyone the answer would usually be `do you have the file with you`the rip=off sickens me to but thats technology
weegeo--------------moaning his head of in the corner
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Post by weegeo on May 10, 2008 13:01:15 GMT
Holy smoke i don`t mean thingy it`s the way the page picked it up i of course said Richard sorry thingy
weegeo
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Post by Emerald Midi on May 10, 2008 13:10:46 GMT
My experience, and I can only go by that, is that for the most part the punters don't really care if it's live music or not. All they want is to go out and enjoy the craic, get up and dance to some good music, etc. |
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Post by thingyy on May 10, 2008 13:13:29 GMT
Thats okay.I had to delete a joke as it got altered and lost its meaning.
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Post by Emerald Midi on May 10, 2008 13:21:16 GMT
Thats okay.I had to delete a joke as it got altered and lost its meaning. ;D ;D |
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Post by Tubbs on May 10, 2008 15:05:54 GMT
My experience, and I can only go by that, is that for the most part the punters don't really care if it's live music or not. All they want is to go out and enjoy the craic, get up and dance to some good music, etc. Exactly Pat, if the vocals and music are good....thats what the punter wants, whether you are in a six piece band or solo with midi/mp3 backings. If technology did not advance, this forum would'nt exist. |
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Post by Emerald Midi on May 10, 2008 15:54:10 GMT
Well, that right, Gerry. Good point. At the end of the day people are free to chose whichever option is appropriate for them. Personally, as a one-man effort I like having the options that are currently available; I remember a time when all I had was guitar and a very basic drum machine! Of course back then it was part of the norm, but these days if I turned up at my gigs with such backing it would all sound rather thinny. Don't get me wrong, such a set up works wonders at some venues and for certain types of music, etc, but not at the venues I currently play in |
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Post by weegeo on May 10, 2008 15:58:14 GMT
Aww yes but thats not my point Gerry we of course need technology but not at the expense of musicianship I/we use midi backing and we play along with it and in that we i think that we enhance the feel of the whole night,no one can say to me your just a Karaoke band because we all play live and if `joe punter`comes up and wants to sing no problem i`ll find his key then off we go lol but i`m afraid up here anyway thats the exception rather than the `norm` hope this clears my thinking a little
weegeo ---------------- [was gonna be funny there lol but maybe not lol]
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Post by Tubbs on May 10, 2008 18:02:07 GMT
And quite right too George, i used to play with a 4-piece band, no backings, just us, but for one man outfits, (which i now am), the dawn of midi has been a blessing, i still play rhythm and lead to them and sing....so technically i am playing "Live". There are lots of top-class singers who do not play instruments........backing tracks have given them a chance to show their talents, i started out on the working mens club circuit in Northern England at age 17, and most of the performers played no instruments....just vocals and backing, and the audience danced and sang along regardless. A couple of month's ago, i went to see a "Live" tribute band ......at least i thought they were live till one of the tracks stalled...had it not been for this mis-hap no one would of noticed, so good at playing air guitar they were. Each to their own opinion though. Just to end, the reason our 4-piece dis-banded was because the pubs and clubs can get a one-man outfilt for a quarter of the price. With the wealth of talent down here, most nights i get a punter up singing, if i know the song i'll back him, if not, i'll stick a backing on and let them get on with it. I do see your point though George......it is a very good topic to debate!!  |
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Post by Emerald Midi on May 10, 2008 18:08:30 GMT
That's a good point about punters using your backing tracks, some of the ones I've had up get terribly lost, which is why I prefer to back them with the keyboard ;d
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Post by charlie on May 12, 2008 15:54:25 GMT
I have heard some very good backing tracks with background vocals and I have also been fascinated with the idea. Trouble is, it's like what was said....the backing vocal tracks are mixed heavy, assuming the vendor wants to make sure you hear how good they sound and shell out for the hefty price tag. There are times, however, when a recording is so laden with a backgroung vocal track...that attempting it live without the vocal track just doesn't make sense. Some examples that come to mind: David Bowie's "Young American" where Luther Vandross is doing the background vocal track. That part Luther is singing is so perfect, to leave it out just leaves the song open and flat. Another example: Bohemian Rhapsody..need I say more? That's when I think to myself....wow, now if I had all those background vocals happening....singing lead would be so cool. But alas, what you have to realize is that the audience already is aware that the music is "computerized". They dont want to have to hear vocals the same way. Some humanizing is crucial to making the audience accept what they're hearing...if for nothing else but to appreciate your vocal abilities. Otherwise, you could turn on the sequencer...run a playlist...and put a full size cardboard cut-out of yourself on stage ..and run it all from your home via the internet....LOL...well maybe it wouldn't be all that simple...but you get my point. The way I have got some satisfaction of having at least harmonies "live" is by using my Digitech Vocalist Live 2. It's a very subtle effect and people for the most part are oblivious to it, that is, until you turn if off and then turn it on again. Wow....sorry I got so carried away. I hope I havent confused you, Tradman....just got lost temporarily....LOL
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Post by charlie on May 12, 2008 15:56:25 GMT
So sorry....I directed my comments to Tradman...when I meant Shyam....LOL...see what I mean...just got lost. Sorry Shyman....a thousand apologies
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